advise needed please

bigbear

I need some advise on sophies behaviour towards my 12 yr old staff zeus . Im getting a bit concerned because she will not leave him alone in the house of garden the problem is he will not put her in her place one he is old and two hes a big softy she goes at him like crazy biting him constantly ears face legs back even hanging off him face when hes trying to get away from her if he does give her a little warning she just lunges straight back at him they dont play like just running around the garden because she is constantly attacking him  and yet he still wont tell her ive trying my best to stop it I tell her off and pull her away and tell her no ive tryed pet correcter ive shouted nothing works I leave them too it hoping he will tell her but still no my mum bought over her jack russle and she tryed the same behaviour with him only he would not take this behaviour and put her right in her place about 3 times did she do it any more NO she left him alone just ran around playing for the first time im at my wits end im worried that if I dont sort this that maybe shell always do it but as she gets bigger it might lead in to a fight I just wish my other dog would just tell her and I know it would help any ideas please.

Jess_Rozo

I'm not sure how old Sophie is, but it seems to me that she is viewing your staffi is above her in the pack order, but actually now his is weaker and his submission/avoidance she is more then likely viewing as an opportunity to raise herself in the pack order. Most dogs in their prime like your mom's jack russel will put her in her place but when you have a certain pack order you want to establish and (especially with the older guys) you as pack leader need to help them out. I have a 12 year old Shih Tzu that is above my bully and it hasn't been the easiest to enforce let me tell you. Their terrier nature makes then very tenacious and stubborn, which is a key part of their charm, but also infuriating when it comes to learning things like this. Since your staffi is avoiding her advances and not helping you out much there are a few things you can do to help him out. When you notice she is getting to rough with him give her time out. Make her submit to you and have him stay near her while she is being reprimanded. With my 2, every time Dozer would chase or be too rough with Gidget it was an automatic lay down on his side and then 15 minutes of her laying across his neck to show dominance. If he would move or struggle I would pin him until he stopped and then we would start all over again. Also every time you feed, treat or address the pack make sure you are doing it in the correct pack order. It is SO easy to confuse pups if you don't do this. The older dog eats first, is addressed first, and is treated first every time and this further enforces her place in the pack below him. It takes persistence but she will come around and the more you are consistent about her respecting your staffi's place above her the less and less she will challenge it and 'beat him up.' 

bigbear

Thank u for your advice I will defo try what u have said and keep u posted

Leslie

Great advice Jess!! My male did this to my female and I still have issues from time to time because I didn't "help her out" . The growel should be a warning not an invatation...... well put!!

bigbear

I am putting a stop too this now I really was torn on what to do ive always corrected her if it got to much but I was hoping he would put her in her place as my mums dog did but zeus is old maybe this is why he wont .

Leslie

My old pitty would have immediatly but some dogs are just more subbmisive is all, do help him out cause you will more than likely have issues ad she grows stronger.

bigbear

This is my concern leslie this is why it has to be stopped now before she gets bigger and stronger .

philsergeant

This is just typical puppy behaviour... My two try to kill each other all the time... It's not a viciousness thing, she will grow out of it... Main thing is to let her know it won't be tolerated... Just like the JR did... Zeus is too kind, but you can't be... Get a smooth wooden spoon and, if in the house, whack her on the butt when she does it... Soon you'll just have to wiggle the spoon and show it to her and she'll back down... You'll need to find something else for her to take her fight to though... A tug rope with your daughter, or a Kong on the end of a springy pole... This is ours in the picture... She'll get the message.

BulliesofNC

How did you get grass to grow on your ceiling??? @-)

bigbear

Thank u phil for your advise, well today we was in the garden and she was going at him big time I screamed no zeus was yelping so I picked up a bit of bamboo stick and wacked her on her bum she ran off she didnt like it she stayed away from him for a bit it but that didnt last long she was biting his ankles his legs fell down on the ground so I wacked her again and for the rest of the day she never attacked him at all is was so nice for the first time I had the patio doors open zeus was in the garden sophie was by the patio door just relaxing no fighting lovely tomorrow is another day we will see ...

philsergeant

@ big bear... One day at a time, little by little she'll get there... Don't worry...
@ Steve... I don't know why pictures flip or lie sideways... When I enlarge them they come the right side up... Do they for you?

Leslie

Little beast anyway.....give Zeus a kiss tell him I said it won't be long:)

BulliesofNC

@philsergeant - I think when you took the photo from your phone you were holding it upside down maybe and when you first viewed the photo you corrected the angle but the original photo was still upside down. Just a guess because I've seen others do the same thing. I fixed the photo for you though.

philsergeant

Thanx Steve.. Tell me how you do that on the site, 'cos it happens all the time... They are " right way up" on my iPad/ phone or computer???

BulliesofNC

I simply downloaded your photo and once I had it on my computer I rotated the photo to correct it. I then went back to the forum and edited your post by deleting your photo and attaching the corrected one I made.

Was that photo taken with your phone?

It's odd that the photo would come up correctly on 3 different devices but not when you attached it. :-??

apollosmama

I had a minor problem with getting nipped in the face. Part play part trying to put me in my place. I did some research on line and came up with this....when puppy bites growl in his neck. So the next Tim He bit my face I played his ARSE out held his neck with my hand and growled like a dog. A mean growl too. The whole article talked about the difference between aggression (which I knew it wasn't) and dominance. Growling and holding down at their neck makes you act like the pack leader. I'm not sure I would be brave enough to do this with a larger or older dog. It was easy to put him in his place but he's still just a little guy. I think if you trust trust Sophie you could try it. She might stop and look to you first before she gets on Zeus. I do think that you should try Jess' s advice!!

apollosmama

PS- after I growled in his neck twice he hasn't even attempted to bite my face.

bigbear

I might give that s go cause she still nipping at my face sometimes she sniff then bite mskes u think shes being all loving a them bang she gets u straight on the nose little moo .

Jess_Rozo

Yes, unfortunately I had to be a much firmer than usual with him on the sheer size difference between them. Even playful behavior could potentially hurt her and being a Toy dog she just doesn't play like a bullie. Her best friend in the world (that unfortunately passed 3 years ago) was a Scotti, so she understood what he was doing and was on cue 90% of the time reprimanding him, I only started having a couple close called when pubescent 50+ lb and growing Bull Terrier was rapidly beginning to dwarf 9 lb Shih Tzu so her reprimands were starting to become meaningless to him until I began reinforcing them. I have had a hard time finding any breed that will tolerate how bullies play other than other bullies, frenchies, and the occasional brave lab. I've had a few issues at dog parks with dogs being really emo about how he plays when he is ridiculously gentle for most bulls, and has zero issues with a pack of all bullies or when he hangs out with his frenchie friend. Now if I can only get him to realize that not all small fuzzies in the world need to be greeted and loved and make their poor owners poo their pants when this 60+ lb bull terrier come over to love on their pooch. He's a big boy so I kind of understand their thought on him potentially eating their precious pooch not knowing his background.

bigbear

Thank u jess for your imput to this topic I am making sure I reinstate zeus to be the boss bless his heart hes such a big softy and a old boy sophie has been doing alot better but will push her luck if left unattended so I makw sure if I go out the room one of them come with me cause im not allowing this behaviour to carry on for my poor boy .

philsergeant

Is Sophie starting to be morel respectful of Zeus now that you've been reinforcing the reprimands strongly?

bigbear

Hi phil yes she has improved a lot being a really good girl thank u for asking .

philsergeant

Terrifik... Hard work pays off!!

bigbear

It certainly does shes being so good