My mother and I both have EBTs from the same litter. We cannot put them together without muzzles because they will fight and hurt each other. How can I stop this?
In general: IF it is possible to stop it, it will probably be a looong process.
But there's way to few information in your post to give any useful advice already.
How old are they, which gender, how long separated, how did they behave with other siblings, do they BOTH fight or only one of them, how exactly do they fight, do they get along with other dogs .... ????
You see, you will need to give A LOT more context, before anyone may be able to help you here with some adivce, I'm afraid.
Sorry I was still working . They are sisters, get along great with every other dog and they will both attack eachother. They spent maybe two weeks apart. They are both 8 months old. When apart as you can see they want to be friends, but if given a chance one or the other will start an attack almost instantly.
Hello, again, please provide more background information. You did not even answer all of the questions I asked before. I am usually a very helpful person. But in order for people to be able to HELP you with advice, one needs to KNOW AS MANY DETAILS OF THE SITUATION, BACKGROUND, PREVIOUS HISTORY of the dogs etc. AS POSSIBLE. Otherwise it is practically impossible for someone to evaluate remotely what's ging on and give any helpful advice for this very special situation, seemingly involving aggression.
Well, maybe someone else can, I can't.
It is not a completely unnatural event for siblings not to get along with each other. There is like a million possible reasons why your two dogs may not like each other and there may or may not be ways to fix that. It depends.
But who knows what happened? Did they get along with each other before and after the separation suddenly they don't? Or did they not like each other from the start? It could even be the case that you misinterpret the situation and they are just playing really rough ... who knows .... who can tell from the small amount of information you've provided ...
Well, I can probably tell you one thing already, because I suspect the following would be my eventual advice anyways: Consult a trainer immediately who can monitor the situation in person and on-site and tell you what to do.
Also it may be a good idea to talk to the breeder who sold the puppies to ask him what to do, and about any history of similar events in this litter, the history of those two puppies and events in his previous litters or sires and dams. His reaction will either be a tell tale story anyways or may even provide you with some REAL help with this issue.
When I spoke to the breeder, he said they were not aggressive in the past. When I saw the puppies together they were fine, until we got them home. So yes, they got along and suddenly do not. As for siblings they got along with them too
I don't think it's really rough playing. Unless rough playing involves latching at the neck, drawing blood, and ripping ears.
Thanks for the trainer advice. I'd love for them to get along but my mother and I are too afraid to let them around eachother now.
First of all, for now as long as the situation is not resolved, I absolutely agree: I would keep them separated to avoid more hurting. But you should also try and find help quickly, because this is just not a comfy situation for everyone involved. Also be prepared to make arrangements in the future to keep them separated, because there is no guarantee that this is a situation that can be resolved. Sometimes it's just as with people: When the chemistry doesn't match, sometimes there's nothing that can be done to fix that.
However, if they got along with each other in the past and they no longer do now, while still getting along with any other dog, that makes me think that something must have happened between the two.
Interestingly enough going for neck and ears even pretty roughly CAN actually be play, also growling can be involved. But I think when you stand right beside the two and watch them, you will most likely be able to tell, if this is just rough play or if they seriously try to fight each other.
Besides, even if it WOULD "only" be very rough play, I agree that hurting each other to the point of bleeding frequently is just not acceptable. So, either way this is a situation that needs correction/help.
It is often said that two specimen of the same gender more often do not get along than female and male. But among siblings that is often not an issue, when they grew up together.
In conclusion as I already assumed, I will stick to my first suggestion to find a good trainer immediately. I think it will be hard for anybody to help you over the internet. This is a special situation. This trainer should be experienced with aggression and ideally with Bull Terriers. But the more important point is the knowledge about dog aggression. He should definitely monitor the situation with the two dogs personally and will then probably ask you a lot of questions and then hopefully be able to tell you more.
Comprehensible enough, you and your mother also seem to be pretty stressed and overwhelmed by the situation, which is why I would rather NOT suggest to do any tests on your own - such as other environments than your home etc. - without competent help, because it can result in more injury for your dogs and even yourself.
If you don't know where to start looking for a good trainer, you can post in different dog forums, tell that the issue is aggression and give the approximate area your are living in (no addresses online, of course!). You can also ask the breeder for suggestions and you can look for rescue groups or other breeders in your area, also dog clubs, play groups etc. and ask around there, if anyone has a good suggestion. Also your vet, groomer, dog sitter or boarding station may have a tip where to find a competent trainer in your area.
I agree not much background information provided...you said they are 8 months, have they ever got along or is this a new thing? Are there toys or food around to provoke a fight over territory? How long have you guys had the pups? Do they only see each other at your house? Have you tried taking them for a walk together on neutral grounds such as a park away from your house (on leashes of course)? It sounds like you and your mom are both apprehensive and have stress when they are together, dogs are extremely sensitive to your feelings. meaning they can feel the tension from your emotions which causes the same feelings within them. Of course it would be natural for you to feel this way but you must remain calm so they feed off of your energy. I agree with seeking out a trainer in your area that deals with aggression. Hopefully this will help, i wish you both the best of luck!
From what I have read it sounds as though your Bullies are competing for alpha dominance. The problem is that once an all out fight occurs the two dogs often have a hard time forgiving and forgetting. All too often the aggression and sudden urge to attack each other can get worse to the point as you describe where they will engage in a fight at the earliest opportunity. Correcting this problem is very difficult even with the most well trained and experienced behavior specialist or trainer. I would have to say that dog aggression is by far one of the most difficult behavior problems to correct in a dog and right now it sounds as though your two bullies are anticipating the opportunity to finish their battle for dominance. Neither will back down from the challenge either and this is a dangerous environment to have with two very strong and powerful dogs. it's one thing to intervene immediately when the aggression initiates but in the event the two dogs get into a full out attack on each other it would be difficult to separate the two and almost impossible for one person. Once their eyes gets glassed over and their adrenaline raises through the roof their full concentration is on the fight which can make it very dangerous for anyone trying to separate the dogs.
Unless your Bullies are actually only playing rough with each (which doesn't sound like the case) you only have two options:
Hire a Good trainer and be prepared for an extensive time frame for the training to be successful enough to allow the dogs together without any worry of a fight.
Look into rehoming one of the dogs to ensure there are no safety risks to you, your family members, and the dogs themselves.
They very well may come from bloodlines in which dog aggression was within their genes. Sadly, there are many Bull Terriers which will not get along with other dogs regardless if it's a sibling. Your Bullies sound as though they have very dominant temperaments and this type of behavior will be something you will always have to keep in mind when they are around any other dogs because in the event another dog was to try and show them dominance or aggression they'd be quick to engage in fight. Not only is a natural reaction for them based on their genes but they have already gotten used to doing so with their own sibling.
- Steve Gogulski "It's not just a Dog, it's a Bull Terrier!" www.bulliesofnc.com
My bully started fighting our other dog over certain things eg attention or food. It started at about 6 months old and got a bit worse around 12 months old (hormones going crazy) but i used calmly grab him say no and take him to the toilet or laundry and lock him in there for about 2 min on his own. That was his punishment and it worked pretty well i also used a water pistol sometimes too. In the end when he looked like he was going to start i just showed him the water pistol and walked away. After the 12 month old stage it got less frequent real quick and now it only happens very rarely over maybe a bit of food. You just have to train them to learn what is right and what is wrong.
You have to learn to recognise when the dog is about to attack. And figure out what triggers the attacks so that you can avoid those situations/things in the future. Also take the aggressive dog into a room on its own and ignore it, then call the other dog into the room and when it comes in make a big fuss and give them both treats. That way they think when the other dog is around, it is a good thing and they get treats and extra fuss/attention. It helped me sort my problem out.
My mum was over for Memorial Day. Her Lola gave me a nice gift as I broke up a fight. I had my pup in the bathroom and Lola (moms pup) got into the room past my six year old son.
Lola definitely seems to be the aggressor. She spent more time with the litter than my pup Lada. Sorry if it's graphic I can remove it. I just thought if this is what she did to me in one bite it may help. Very swollen!
Keep the dogs separated! Not even in the same house - one dog seems to live with you, the other with your mom in a different place as it sounds. So it should be easy to keep them separated.
And find professional 1:1 help!
This is clearly something you will NOT be able to get a hold of yourself!
I would seek a professional evaluation with the dog that bit you either way, because this looks like there are some general aggression control issues going on here. And chances are they will become a bigger problem when the dog matures. For now it may get along with other dogs. But there is no guarantee and these marks are not just a little accident. If you did not find a trainer yet, maybe at least talk to your vet for some advice on the situation.
No experiments, my advice! You need professional help with these issues NOW!
Don't wait until everyone is so afraid of the attacking dog that there is no other way out than the dog ending up being re-homed ... although I am not sure, if you are not past this point already ...
Thanks Djammy I'm trying. I called my local humane society to get advice with the aggressor. She's a sweet dog she just has a lot of territory problems. My mom thinks it's because she may have had to fight for her food with the breeder. However when Lola is here we never put food down. She is very possessive with her humans. Anytime another dog is near a family member she stares the dog down. My mom really loves the dog and id love for her to stay in her home. Maybe some classes could help
One thing is for sure: This dog needs an understanding, skilled, consistent and FIRM handler, which I hope your mother is. Staring contests with other dogs and overly territorial and protective behavior at that age are not totally unusual, but really need to be directed the right way, especially at a young age. Or it will turn into a lot of missed chances. Also if you don't mind me stating this: This kind of behavior is not exactly "being GOOD with other dogs''!!! So you should really look and see, if your evaluation of the situation is 100% correct, or if you may have missed some aspects so far.
As soon as dogs with such a strong temperament get the feeling that THEY are the ones to make the decisions and check out strangers, other dogs etc. FOR the owner (and not the owner himself), things can become very complicated. The ideal situation is that a dog will be able and willing to defend the owner, if necessary. But on the other hand the dog should completely rely on the owner to show it when it's time to take action and when not. It should not show proactive aggressive behavior and evaluate situations completely by itself to identify threats.
It is not unusual for some dogs to become very territorial with owners who do not provide a lot of leadership and guidance. Often such dogs behave like "leash Rambo's" with one owner, while being a completely different dog when handled by a confident person who gives clear guidance and instructions.
I don't know your mom and I don't know how much dog and Bull Terrier experience she has. And I am not stating the above IS the case with her.
I just can't manage to shake off the feeling that something like this may be part of the problem. AND if you suspect that the things above COULD play any role in this, I strongly suggest that your mom - she owns the dog that keeps attacking, correct? - should REALLY really get into dog training and a deeper understanding of dogs and how to guide and manage them RIGHT NOW. Because she will really need to know how to give the dog confidence, how to grow its trust in her and how to handle situations such as the one that led to you being bitten. This dog needs a firm handler - and can become a very sweet companion that way, that may only need some managing here and there. Maybe this dog will never be a real pal for other dogs. That's no problem with proper handling and a skilled owner. But if proper handling and an insecure owner are part of the problem, this dog will probably rather be a walking risk of more injury on four legs in the future!
It's NOT the dog's fault. This is just something that needs the right handling and circumstances.
Last but not least, I would advise to make sure that everything is ok with the dog physically. Because health problems and pain can also trigger some unexpected reactions.
Get well soon! That bite looks like it really hurts ...
I'm sorry to hear about this incident happening to you. My comments and advice written above should be making more an more sense now as you can see the problem escalating. Your best bet is to commit to keeping the dogs as only pets within the household. All the fights, dominance, and aggression has surely developed some bad habits which will be difficult for any trainer to adjust their temperament into one that could be trustworthy will all dogs. If you wish to chance the two dogs being in the same house together I encourage the use of muzzles to eliminate mistakes that allow another fight. The use of muzzles were made for dogs that fit the temperament of your Bullies. They are used for safety not for cruelty. Again, I'm sorry to hear you got bit breaking up another fight. I hope it's their last fight but that depends on your decisions in regard to allowing them to continue to live together.
- Steve Gogulski "It's not just a Dog, it's a Bull Terrier!" www.bulliesofnc.com
Comments
again, please provide more background information. You did not even answer all of the questions I asked before.
I am usually a very helpful person. But in order for people to be able to HELP you with advice, one needs to KNOW AS MANY DETAILS OF THE SITUATION, BACKGROUND, PREVIOUS HISTORY of the dogs etc. AS POSSIBLE.
Otherwise it is practically impossible for someone to evaluate remotely what's ging on and give any helpful advice for this very special situation, seemingly involving aggression.
It is not a completely unnatural event for siblings not to get along with each other. There is like a million possible reasons why your two dogs may not like each other and there may or may not be ways to fix that. It depends.
Well, I can probably tell you one thing already, because I suspect the following would be my eventual advice anyways:
Consult a trainer immediately who can monitor the situation in person and on-site and tell you what to do.
His reaction will either be a tell tale story anyways or may even provide you with some REAL help with this issue.
When I spoke to the breeder, he said they were not aggressive in the past. When I saw the puppies together they were fine, until we got them home. So yes, they got along and suddenly do not. As for siblings they got along with them too
I don't think it's really rough playing. Unless rough playing involves latching at the neck, drawing blood, and ripping ears.
Thanks for the trainer advice. I'd love for them to get along but my mother and I are too afraid to let them around eachother now.
Also be prepared to make arrangements in the future to keep them separated, because there is no guarantee that this is a situation that can be resolved.
Sometimes it's just as with people: When the chemistry doesn't match, sometimes there's nothing that can be done to fix that.
However, if they got along with each other in the past and they no longer do now, while still getting along with any other dog, that makes me think that something must have happened between the two.
Interestingly enough going for neck and ears even pretty roughly CAN actually be play, also growling can be involved. But I think when you stand right beside the two and watch them, you will most likely be able to tell, if this is just rough play or if they seriously try to fight each other.
Besides, even if it WOULD "only" be very rough play, I agree that hurting each other to the point of bleeding frequently is just not acceptable.
So, either way this is a situation that needs correction/help.
It is often said that two specimen of the same gender more often do not get along than female and male. But among siblings that is often not an issue, when they grew up together.
In conclusion as I already assumed, I will stick to my first suggestion to find a good trainer immediately.
I think it will be hard for anybody to help you over the internet. This is a special situation.
This trainer should be experienced with aggression and ideally with Bull Terriers. But the more important point is the knowledge about dog aggression. He should definitely monitor the situation with the two dogs personally and will then probably ask you a lot of questions and then hopefully be able to tell you more.
Comprehensible enough, you and your mother also seem to be pretty stressed and overwhelmed by the situation, which is why I would rather NOT suggest to do any tests on your own - such as other environments than your home etc. - without competent help, because it can result in more injury for your dogs and even yourself.
If you don't know where to start looking for a good trainer, you can post in different dog forums, tell that the issue is aggression and give the approximate area your are living in (no addresses online, of course!). You can also ask the breeder for suggestions and you can look for rescue groups or other breeders in your area, also dog clubs, play groups etc. and ask around there, if anyone has a good suggestion. Also your vet, groomer, dog sitter or boarding station may have a tip where to find a competent trainer in your area.
Good luck! Keep us posted on what happens.
Unless your Bullies are actually only playing rough with each (which doesn't sound like the case) you only have two options:
They very well may come from bloodlines in which dog aggression was within their genes. Sadly, there are many Bull Terriers which will not get along with other dogs regardless if it's a sibling. Your Bullies sound as though they have very dominant temperaments and this type of behavior will be something you will always have to keep in mind when they are around any other dogs because in the event another dog was to try and show them dominance or aggression they'd be quick to engage in fight. Not only is a natural reaction for them based on their genes but they have already gotten used to doing so with their own sibling.
"It's not just a Dog, it's a Bull Terrier!"
www.bulliesofnc.com
Are you sure you aren't a politician?
Lola definitely seems to be the aggressor. She spent more time with the litter than my pup Lada.
Sorry if it's graphic I can remove it. I just thought if this is what she did to me in one bite it may help. Very swollen!
Outch!
Staring contests with other dogs and overly territorial and protective behavior at that age are not totally unusual, but really need to be directed the right way, especially at a young age. Or it will turn into a lot of missed chances.
Also if you don't mind me stating this: This kind of behavior is not exactly "being GOOD with other dogs''!!! So you should really look and see, if your evaluation of the situation is 100% correct, or if you may have missed some aspects so far.
As soon as dogs with such a strong temperament get the feeling that THEY are the ones to make the decisions and check out strangers, other dogs etc. FOR the owner (and not the owner himself), things can become very complicated.
The ideal situation is that a dog will be able and willing to defend the owner, if necessary. But on the other hand the dog should completely rely on the owner to show it when it's time to take action and when not. It should not show proactive aggressive behavior and evaluate situations completely by itself to identify threats.
It is not unusual for some dogs to become very territorial with owners who do not provide a lot of leadership and guidance. Often such dogs behave like "leash Rambo's" with one owner, while being a completely different dog when handled by a confident person who gives clear guidance and instructions.
I don't know your mom and I don't know how much dog and Bull Terrier experience she has. And I am not stating the above IS the case with her.
AND if you suspect that the things above COULD play any role in this, I strongly suggest that your mom - she owns the dog that keeps attacking, correct? - should REALLY really get into dog training and a deeper understanding of dogs and how to guide and manage them RIGHT NOW.
Because she will really need to know how to give the dog confidence, how to grow its trust in her and how to handle situations such as the one that led to you being bitten.
This dog needs a firm handler - and can become a very sweet companion that way, that may only need some managing here and there. Maybe this dog will never be a real pal for other dogs. That's no problem with proper handling and a skilled owner. But if proper handling and an insecure owner are part of the problem, this dog will probably rather be a walking risk of more injury on four legs in the future!
It's NOT the dog's fault. This is just something that needs the right handling and circumstances.
If you wish to chance the two dogs being in the same house together I encourage the use of muzzles to eliminate mistakes that allow another fight. The use of muzzles were made for dogs that fit the temperament of your Bullies. They are used for safety not for cruelty.
Again, I'm sorry to hear you got bit breaking up another fight. I hope it's their last fight but that depends on your decisions in regard to allowing them to continue to live together.
"It's not just a Dog, it's a Bull Terrier!"
www.bulliesofnc.com