Country life is too tempting for my BT!

bhardypr

We live on 9 acres in the country. Our 5 year old, neutered male BT has access to our side yard (approx 1 acre) and is contained by an invisible fence. I'm concerned about his growing propensity to "hunt." I understand that he has a high predator instinct, and we all know that bullies love to chase and subdue any little critters they can. There are instances where it's "worth the zap" to run the fence and get that critter!

He does seem to be very territorial and if any animals enter his space, it's not good. I'm worried that he will become more aggressive b/c he has caught a couple of things, and it wasn't pretty. Has anyone else dealt with this?

Other than that, our Sammy is the perfect family dog. He's well-mannered, sweet, loving, and gentle with our kids. Thoughts?

philsergeant

Oh! You gotta know...Bullies are great hunts(wo)man. Especially our girl.... They both luv the wild, all the scents and creatures, and get totally overly excited when they spot a squirrel, armadillo, cat, raccoon, lizard, big birds, and their favourite... The fox. They went after a fox the other morning, and after it let out the most amazing yelps that sounded more like a scolded cat, they started making the most uncontrollable yelps of hunting delight themselves. ... It was quite amazing . But we keep them tethered, with a 50 ft rope, otherwise we'd never find them in the dense undergrowth here. They dive right in. But they love bigger animals and go up and kiss them, like horses, alpacas ( we have a bunch around here, you know those tax avoidance farmers) ... They love deer and I think they'd kiss them too if they could catch up.... But the little ones drive them nutso. A one acre invisible fence must cost an arm and a leg... But I wouldn't trust it to hold them if they saw some good prey. Come on you gotta post photos... It's the fee for being here. Did you get him young? Has the aggression developed, how is he with other dogs... Do you socialize him at the dog park?

bhardypr

Thanks for your post, Phil. It's so nice to hear from other bully owners who "get it." Sammy is our third BT so we understand their very unique characteristics. I've never had one this prey-oriented, and it has freaked out some of the neighbors, I think. Of course, that's their problem but I want to be a good and considerate neighbor. 

I think you're right. We just can't trust the invisible fence to contain him, and it's not really fair to taunt him that way, I guess! You tether your sweet girl with what kind of rope?

We've had Samson since he was about 8 weeks old. The aggression developed as age-appropriate. It wasn't sudden. We neutered him at age 2. He has always been very territorial. He has not been socialized much at all, which is a shame, but we live WAY out in the country and there are no dog parks. There are dogs in the neighborhood - all lots are 10+ acres, but those dogs are equally socially awkward. He gets along fine with the other dog we own. He loves her and they snuggle.

I agree with your sentiment that we should consider a tether or fenced dog run.

I attach a couple of pictures of the sweet boy. Thanks for asking. We love him so much!

philsergeant

These are the ropes we use, they are 50ft long, you can get them at KV Supply I think.  There are not too many roads around here, but when you find one there's always some dick texting at 60mph, so we don't feel safe enough to let them roam free, but the 50ft sure gives them enough slack.  The brindle is Marco and his sister is Isabella

philsergeant

Also the rope lets them get close enough to kiss the horse but we can still make sure he doesn't get kicked in the head by going under the fence.

philsergeant

If they don't have regular exposure to other dogs i am sure they must get territorial and intolerant... so, despite some of the a-hole owners at the dog park, we take the kids the 8 mile ride there every week.  This is kinda the rope, can't find the exact one we bought, I'll keep looking... it had good really hardware.... This ones from Gun Dog Store.

Soapskid

I also recommend what Phil is saying about the 50ft lead. Spud's trainer for one or two classes shows owners using the 50ft lead for off leash training.

bhardypr

Thanks to both of you for responding! 

Phil, your bullies are beautiful! What a great pair they are. I like the harness you use, too. I'll have to look for something similar for tethering. Thinking about maybe building a long dog run too. 

As I'm sure you can imagine, there's more to this story. We had someone enter our property without permission and without me at home. She was walking her horse and mini pony over to say hi (new neighbor). Sammy bit the horse in typical terrier style. I'm really struggling with what to do. Very upsetting event but we are responsible owners and nothing like this has ever happened. And it wouldn't have happened if a stranger hadn't entered his space. I am very stressed and upset about what to do.

We've even considered rehoming him if we cannot provide a safe space for him. It would crush our family to lose Sammy-boo.

philsergeant

Well I hate to say there's possibly some disciplining needed too.... I'd say it's very unusual for an EBT to attack a larger animal unprovoked.  We try and teach them to enjoy other animals by taking them as close to them as is safe (for both), and if they even get too excited we reprimand them so that they understand that any bad behaviour will not be tolerated.  They have to be gentle with everything... and they do strive to please, but if the repercussions for misbehaving are not harsh they won't learn. It totally peeves me off at the dog park when the owner of an obviously "potentially aggressive" dog is growling or snapping a little, they sit on their fat duffs and say, from a distance, "oh Bowzer, bad boy"... "stop that now".... instead of going over and pinning them to the ground and screaming NO at the top of their voices.   When other owners see me do the same (for less) they ask; "well, is that really necessary?", and my response usually is... Well we've tried sitting down and chatting about the subject with them, and typically that doesn't work. (probably why their teenagers are unruly too)... So maybe re-invite the horse owner (if they are big enough) and keep Sammy tethered until they are kissing pals?

bhardypr

That's a fair point, Phil. I have no idea if he was provoked or not. Discipline is always a challenge. We have done great with people and other manners, but not much w other animals. I don't know that the neighbor would be willing but we could socialize him better with our own horse.

As far as disciplining him in relation to the event, unfortunately I wasn't there so I couldn't intervene and pin him down. I was able to discipline him once I caught up to him but I'm not sure he knew why at that point.

Either way, more training is needed. I bought a tie out similar to the one you showed me above. It's nice.

philsergeant

P.S. I think most Bullie owners agree that it's best for all to keep a bullie crated, even if indoors, while you are not home. As long as this is not extended hours they are good with it as long as they get plenty of exercise and freedom when you're home.... And yes, timing is everything... punishing him later is just about as beneficial as "the chat".  ... Gotta happen right away.

bhardypr

And I really appreciate your candor. I need to know how to correct this situation or will have to do something more drastic that's really not fair to the pup.

bhardypr

Ha! Our messages crossed. Yes, I usually crate him inside whenever we aren't at home. I was just out for a walk and the kids were home. Honestly, it could've been a really awful and tragic thing. Lesson learned...if Mom or Dad aren't home, even if only out for a stroll through the 'hood, he needs to be crated.

philsergeant

Just a crazy question... if you go out a'strollin' da 'hood :-), how come you don't take him with you for the walk?

bhardypr

I do sometimes, Phil, and I really enjoy walking with my little man. I use a gentle leader which has been amazing for teaching him to heel during walks. (It's a little awkward though b/c the gentle leader is hard with such a big nose!!)

Honestly, the reason I don't take him as often as I'd like is b/c the other dogs in the 'hood are quite aggressive...not all of them, but enough to make it not worth the trip. Most of them are contained by an invisible fence, but there are several who roam and follow us and annoy us. The worst issue is that NONE of the owners are there to address or correct their own dogs. They clearly leave them outside all day to their own devices, with no supervision at all. So, it's just me and Sammy, strolling through the 'hood, and trying to avoid a confrontation with other dogs. It's not at all relaxing and impossible for me to "correct" and teach Sammy when these other dogs are wide open.

But I hear what you're saying. I need to seek out and find opportunities for him to socialize with other dogs. I've rarely done it b/c it was so stressful for me. I need to put on my big girl shorts and just deal with it. I know he's sociable b/c he loves playing with our other dog. 

exiled

bhardypr, Rodney has been with us around six weeks now.  We are in the middle of the city, so we cannot walk one block without someone else with a dog, cars whizzing by, cyclists, kids screaming, and worst of all...dogs off of leashes.  It is scary, and I dread going out each time because I never know what I'll encounter.  Reading you last comment, I think I understand how you probably feel. 

We haven't had a chance to check out some dog parks in town, but we have started taking him to a doggy resort/spa at least once a week.  I don't know if that's an option, but it's been a great opportunity for him to socialize with other dogs under supervision.  Is there one close to you?  They do temperament testing the first time.  He plays all day, then he goes for his pampering.  He comes back home clean and happily exhausted.  Just throwing that out there in case there's a doggy day care place close to you so that you can give it a try.

philsergeant

Wow that day spa sounds cooler than heck.... Bet you it costs a paw and a tail.

bhardypr

HAHAHAA, Phil!  BTW, I bought a tie-out with a 30' lead on it. He's sitting in the sunshine right now, enjoying life, and I'm able to relax knowing that if an errant neighbor wanders by with her horse, all will be ok!

Exiled, that sounds like a nice option. Not sure we have anything like that here, but I can absolutely find ways to socialize him better. It takes effort, but it's important. Even just going to the local Petco where you can take your dog is a good thing. We also have dog-friendly shopping mall here.

Here's a picture of Samson playing with his Kong!

exiled

It does cost a paw and a tail, LOL!  I think the dog park membership is under $100, but the day at the doggy spa is over $50 a day.  You know, I'd feel guilty pampering myself at that price.  Two days at the spa cost as much as a year at the park.  I am still getting over a horrible accident that severely limits my walking, and running is out of the question, so I kind of have to stick to the easier option of bringing him there and letting them chase after a yard full of dogs.

Only suggested that as a last resort (pun unintended) if the park is farther than a doggy day care.  The dog-friendly mall sounds ideal.  I've never tried the dog training at PetSmart, but I think they have those in the stores here.  That would be another controlled option for dog socialization. 

Sammy is a doll.  Hope all works out well, and the neighbors ask before coming onto your property. 

BulliesofNC

It's probably a lot easier to get a Bull Terrier socialized with horses during their early puppy stages like you would do socializing them with other dogs or even cats. Often when they get older and see other animals for the first time or even other animals that they have never spent much time with they just don't know how to act around them and if they get nervous, intimidated, or feel threatened they can resort to aggression as an instinctive response.
Early socialization is very important.

bhardypr

I hear you, Steve. We've had our horse longer than Samson, so he's grown up with her. He doesn't have access to the pasture though b/c he would always chase her around. It was definitely more of a playful thing, not aggressive. But we didn't allow it b/c we were afraid he'd get kicked in the head! Plus, the horse didn't like it. She's just an old girl who wants to graze!

I like Phil's idea of having the tie-out close enough to the pasture so he can see her and give her kisses (if he'd ever progress to that stage). It is definitely a challenge being out in the country where there isn't much opportunity for socialization with other dogs. I will absolutely have to be very focused on that for him and find such opportunities.

That picture of the bullie leading the horse just kills me!